Engine Undertray

[Guest sufc38]

Hi,

 

Does anyone know if the engine undertray from a 2000 Sharan (facelift) will fit on a 1998 model.

 

Mike

[Guest marcusheawood]

No idea, but they are a bluddy nuisance aren't they.

 

Leave the thing off so that next time it goes wrong you can fix it easily.

 

It's only there to reduce noise and prevent the oil leaks from dripping on the floor where it's parked so's VW doesn't get embarrassed that a car they charged all that money for new leaks oil like every uvver motah.

[Rallim]

I think it does a bit more than that... it protects the sump and stops water getting onto the auxillary belt - which can in turn lead to slipping belts and power steering loss... well that was what I was lead to understand elsewhere on the forums. :lol:

 

Which is why I'm determined to get the garage who I bought my Sharan off to replace it when they 'lost' when it was in for repair... :o

 

 

Gordon

[Guest marcusheawood]

Why, have you had all these problems mentioned? Cos' I sure as s**t ain't.

 

Sounds like a myth to me; polyvee belts will work UNDER water, so that's errant nonsense.

 

And how, pray, will a chunk of GRP protect your METAL sump?

 

VW fit them to ALL cars now, it's also to deter home mechanics from performing basic service operations, part of the "that's not an engine, it's a really complicated black box containing no user serviceable parts"

 

However did we cope before undertrays?

[Rallim]

Like I said its what I've read elsewhere...

 

See this thread

 

On my tdi engine the sump has what looks like some form of sensor with two wire protuding out of it right at the base and it looks rather exposed and vulnerable, the tray would at least stop stones etc catching it or the wires... but heh maybe its me and my paranoia! :D

It also stops crap getting into the engine bay, my previous car an Audi 80 also had a tray and the engine bay was very clean in comparison to previous cars that didnt have one. I do agree they are a pain when you want to do work on the engine, and that probably one of the reasons they are fitted.

 

Gordon.

[seatkid]

DO NOT DRIVE WITHOUT THE UNDERTRAY. The Galaxy has a vunerable design and there are many documented instances of loss of power steering as a result. Ford and VW warn about this.

 

Your insurance would be invalid if you drove knowingly without this and you had an accident involving loss of power steering.

 

marcusheawood is talking **** when he says polyvee belts work under water.

 

[Edit: Apologies to marcusheawood for language.....]

Edited July 7, 2005 by seatkid

[Guest marcusheawood]

Don't overreact man, he has the the VR6 petrol engine like mine NOT the TDi like yours! Mine works fine.

 

FYI Polyvee belts were designed to overcome the problems associated with the old V belts, and as a consequence are designed to run at a higher tension and "squeeze" any liquid out as they rotate.

 

They will run under water without slipping, it was part of the design brief.

 

I didn't expect such an overbearing attitude from you Seatkid, there was humour in my post...but F**k ALL in yours!

[seatkid]

I think youre confusing horizontal ribbed belts with poly-v belts. A ribbed belt has lateral ribs and yes the water can be squeezed out of a traditional two part pulley. A poly-v however has longitudinal grooves and water (in the inner v's) has no-where to go on a high speed machined pulley (except continue round the pulley). Poly V belts were developed many years ago to transmit much higher power than a single v belt.

 

The horizontal ribbed belt was developed for higher grip in a contaminated environment but are not used in the Galaxy.

 

Anything that might comprise safety should not be encouraged on this forum...

[Guest sufc38]

So, anyway, getting back to the original topic.

 

Will the Galaxy undertray fit ths Sharan and do they differ engine to engine.

 

I am still driving with the cover on but it's cracked around two of the mounts, so needs replacing.

 

Thanks for all your replys, but chill guys, this is supposed to be fun as well as informative.

 

Mike

[Guest j_mchattie]

V belts have a larger surface area than flat belts, so can handle larger forces before slipping.

 

Surely therefore they can run under less tension and still provide the same force handling, because they grip better?

 

As for heat, thats down to the type of material.

 

Underwater? Maybe, can't see why not. But why would a car manufacturer put this in the spec? 'Belt must be capable of running underwater' - nope.

 

GRP is stronger than you may think, it provides good protection for very little weight. Just the fact that the GRP will spread the load of a hit over the whole sump shows added protection to piercing etc...

 

If its there, its there for a reason (currently unbeknown to us), and id put it on. Car manufacturers can't afford to waste money on bolt-ons that aren't needed - its not competitive. So there is a reason for it. Might simply be a heatshield to stop leaves from setting on fire under the car.

 

Back to the original question, - Ill see if its on the TIS this afternoon.

 

Watch the language guys.

[Guest j_mchattie]

From the TIS pictures, they look very different. But the pictures are line drawings - so i may be wrong. However, the differences are major (i.e. shape and bolt holes) - so i would go with a NO.

[Dave-G]

You WILL get a loss of power steering if you drive through a puddle of water while cornering - even worse - it occurrs spasmodically.

 

power steering becomes extremely hard if power is lost - imagine it slipping then catching then slipping again...

 

Maybe marcus has been lucky enough to get his belts wet only on the straight parts of his neighourhood - but here in leicester wet belt slip is alive and well

 

What price your life? or the kid that maybe got in the way of an AVOIDABLE FAILURE

[Guest sufc38]

:D Rang VW up for a price on a brand new undertray.

 

Get this

[greg_68]

Hi,

what do scrapyards do when they take the engine out?

would you get one from there?

I agree you definitely need one, as someone else stated Ford wouldn't fit it if it wasn't needed.

I would take a visit to the local scrappy.

[Guest sufc38]

Hi,

 

Tried the local scrappy's that I know (unless anyone knows of any in Stockport area) and parts gateway etc on t'internet with no joy.

 

The undertray I've got is still fitted to my Shaz but is cracked and a couple of the mounting points are chuffed as well, so I reckon I'll have to try and fix it with fibreglass (havent used the stuff for years mainly on old beetles).

 

I reckon the reason mine's taken so much hammer is that the VR6 is quite a bit lower than a standard Shaz or Gal and for some reason there's some idiot on Stocport county council who absoluteley loves screwing peoples cars up with speed bumps, Ive never seen so many as there are round here.

 

Mike

[Guest barney]

My wife decided to run the car over a very large pavement and ripped the Undertray off, along with the steering cooler and inter cooler!

Anyway I managed to repair the tray with Glassfibre , since the dirt got on the tray after fitting you cant tell the difference!

[Guest marcusheawood]

I absolutely love this board...it is the only place I know where you can get slagged for relating personal experience by armchair theoreticians.

 

After narrowly escaping immolation and death by patronisation for daring to suggest you try driving your VR6 Shalaxy without an undertray, I've decided after countless hours spent poring over manuals, service data, and computer software to refit my undertray before the entire southeastern corner of England slides into the sea due to MY negligence.

 

I have however decided NOT to refit the STEEL undertray to my T4 Transporter van, because; whilst there are many here who may have an opinion about this, I have decided that there is a possibility that they may not be sufficiently qualified to be trusted with that opinion. And anyway it's been off for so long i'm thinking of chucking it away :D

 

Since it is a diesel van; some of you may have some useful understanding of the fuel system. However there is nothing wrong with it, so thanks, but not necessary.

It also has an 02A Gearbox in common with some other vehicles in the VW range, again despite many miles there are no problems, thanks again for the offer though.

 

If I post here it is to relate my experience to those who might appreciate the practical advantages gained from the altruistic sharing of knowledge by someone who's worked for many years as a professional independant mechanic (a good one too!). Although much of my knowledge is out of date since I'm a multitrader now (much better money :D )

 

If I don't know, then I won't guess.

 

Yo sufc38, how long has your undertray been awol?

 

So much for Pub genii! Oderint dum metuant. :D

[Guest sufc38]

Hi,

 

My undertray is still hanging on but only just!!

 

Mike

[tim-spam]

If the undertray is made from GRP, a repair with fibreglass should be very effective. Perhaps if you bonded in some large flat washers at the attachment points it would make a stronger job.

As regards the price, it does seem a bit steep, but it is a very bulky item to ship and store, so I guess that may have something to do with it.

Tim

[Guest jtwonk]

Basically the engine undertray serves 2 main purposes, the main reason being to contain as much engine noise as possible within the engine bay. This is typical technology used by just about every manufacturer. The logic being that all vehicles sold in th EU have to pass stringent homologation tests for emissions, noise etc. The noise is measured outside the car at a distance of 7.5 metres from each side of the car as it drive passed the microphone. The undertray contains the noise within the engine bay, & also as there is a type of soft urethane material on the inside this helps absorb the noise. This also helps to reduce the engine noise in the cabin. This is the same reason the undertray has sides on which seal it to the inner wing area, & also why there is a large engine cover on the rocker cover covered in absorption material & the inside of the bonnet has some more absorbitive material on.

The second reason is to control the cooling performance of the engine by directing the air flow under the engine. This will probably also help with the aerodynamics of the car a little bit as ithen will have a flatter underbody.

 

Jonathan :blink:

[Dave-G]

"personal experience by armchair theoreticians."

 

Marcus - I have been there, done that, and had numerouse slippages mate :blink:

 

which is why I felt qualified to point out the danger

[Guest marcusheawood]

Mate, you drive a DIESEL it is not remotely the same installation!

 

I was only talking about my experience with a manual PETROL VR6, just like the one the original poster was asking about.

 

I do not own, and never have owned a shalaxy TDi, so you will NEVER see me offer any advice about engine issues with one.

 

I'll stick with what I know...

[Masked Marauder]

I could be wrong, I am not at home to check, but there is something on the TIS under Technical Bulletins about power steering belt slip, and IIRC it covers all engine variants.

 

Even water ingress through the towing eye hole can cause it if the cover is missing.

[seatkid]

I suppose Ford own engineers are also armchair theoreticians...

 

TECHNICAL SERVICE BULLETIN No.058/2000

Car and Light/Medium Commercial 18.05.2000

 

Section: 211-02 (13)

 

Model: All Galaxy, built to 04.2000 (build code YG) inclusive

 

Markets: All

 

Subject: Power steering V-belt slips when wet

[Guest marcusheawood]

Jesus you just won't give up willya,

 

I'M ONLY TALKING ABOUT MY OWN EXPERIENCES HERE, SO IF YOU DISAGREE SUIT YOURSELVES, EMPIRICISTS TAKE THE HINDMOST OBVIOUSLY!

 

I'm not trying to givie advice here, it's all been a bit tongue in cheek.

 

BUT I WON'T POST TONGUE IN ARSE, so if you don't like it SHOVE IT BOY!

 

(You never answer real tough questions anyway!)

 

buncha brown nosers :)